Two cracking river patterns. The DHE has certainly helped my catch rate, and once I learned to hash one together gives a nice slim upward tapering profile. It's when the big olive upwings appear that it becomes very, very valuable and mostly I stick one on before a floating dun for instance. So at these times the DHE is king, or is it?
The CDC/Elk is something I've been using more of each year. When I pick one out I wonder how this fly works. It's like a bundle of thistle down (well mine are anyway) and I can't see a shape at all. But it works, and very well at that. For me the CDC/Elk works when nothing is on the water to when trout are taking small stuff, even smuts. Once I get on to the small streams and burns one in a #16 is all I need.
It has helped me out on so many different situations, but this year I've found out it works at the times when I would previously be tying on a DHE. Bang, offers straight off and on fish that had refused the DHE.
So.... during my long spells staring at riseless water I've tried to come up with a theory, and here it is.
The DHE drifts down in a lifeless fashion, no real movement, perhaps due to the body being hung, almost anchored under the surface and also the compactness of the fly (well mine are anyway) with no movement.
The CDC/Elk sits higher and seems to bounce with the drift and turns either way along with the small currents very nicely but not in dragging sort of way. And of course the cdc strands must also give the appearance of life. All in I think it offers a decent representation of a big olive trying to unravel and that can be tempting to the troot.
I need both, but over the season I know which one I need more.
A CDC/Elk getting slowly ripped up during a hatch of big olive upwings yesterday
[attachimg=1]
Yeah, CDC+ Elk is a marvelous fly. I too have caught fish on it when other flies have failed.
I reckon it's the legs, not saying these CDC strands represent legs per sey more that they impart movement in an otherwise lifeless fly as you have noted yourself. Same goes for terrestrial patterns with long thin rubber legs. I am however far less convinced with standard hoppers with knotted pheasant tail legs as they seem a bit stiff and lifeless and in some tyings they are on the top of the fly.
Quote from: Alan on May 18, 2013, 11:17:23 PM
They are both the top flies of different stages, the DHE the emerger stage, the CDC/Elk the hatched fly(and crippled) both the most generic and flexible of their type, with these two you don't need the rest, but you need both,
I'm thinking they can both represent a fly at the same stage. I tend to hedge ma bets by tying CDC/Elk on a curved hook but its still a higher riding fly. Although I saw it as an all rounder I've found its good enough to match and better the DHE when its (DHE) at the most effective period - during hatches of olive uprights. These flies don't hang below the surface motionless for long (like buzzers), they are straight on the surface trying to unravel wings and legs and that's where the twitching of a CDC/Elk comes good.
Mac
Only issue I have with the CDC+ Elk is the CDC :lol:
As a material it's a high maintenance pain, unusable when you are catching loads of small fish, but then it's not really needed under those circumstances I suppose.
Quote from: admin on May 19, 2013, 09:01:57 AM
Only issue I have with the CDC+ Elk is the CDC :lol:
As a material it's a high maintenance pain, unusable when you are catching loads of small fish, but then it's not really needed under those circumstances I suppose.
Aye, I've stopped using it on its own for wings or posts. Looks nice but gives up in the floating department too easily.
CDC&Elk is one of my favorites; mainly on lochs rather than rivers but I don't fish rivers that much though.
I'd agree the movement of the CDC strands giving the appearance of life is one of the things about the fly; even in calm conditions fished static the water currents will still move them when other materials like rubber legs, hair, hackles wouldn't or need pulled to work.
My other theory (totally unscientific as all my theories are :)) is that its a very good general imitation of all kinds of terrestrial flies. Tied with roe deer hair mine look worryingly like clegs - I've even tried to swat them a few times when glimpsed out of the corner of my eye :)
I do like the DHE but tend to use it more when there's a hatch on.
Both are great patterns that I keep in my box, I do like the new improved DHE a bit more. The Bullet from Chris Sandford is another set that I am excited about trying out on my next trip.
http://www.chrissandford.com/why-do-they-bite-the-bullet (http://www.chrissandford.com/why-do-they-bite-the-bullet)
the cdc & elk has been a long time favourite of mine and works better than the dhe for me but I do use both.
Have to say I've never felt the need to tie on a CDC-n-elk, DHE does the business every time in a hatch of upwings, also for midge-feeding risers on a flat calm loch. Basically, any time Im targetting rising fish, it's the first (and usually last) fly out of the box.
Squirrel fur body for olives on the river, wee black one in a buzzer hatch, great big olive green one for mayfly, hare's ear for everything else.
My favourite 'dry' :)
Two great flies, I'm from the school of Deergravy in relation to the DHE, thanks Dave :D
Well, I've been fishing the CDC/Elk exclusively now for about six weeks and when I get it right I'm getting takes first time of asking on every troot barring one dog day afternoon when nothing was going to shift them other someone who knows how to fish nymphs correctly or a more skilled angler than me (one nosed a small upstream spider) and another day when a fish was gorging on iron blue duns (an adams emerger took care of that one)
On Monday I was fishing a stream very low at summer level. They were taking the odd medium dun but more often it was tiny sips to smuts. The fly caught one in slow water right at the edge barely deep enough to cover its back at two and three quarter lbs. I lost five other good fish that day, I had to crawl hands and knees to get to them, Draper knee pads ordered and delivered.
It's worked when yellow sally's were crawling about my hat and last year tempted a nice troot that was taking stuff I could not see. Its fooled my biggest fish this season that was not particularly active and accounted for my last fish last season of about a quarter pound from a small burn in October.
Got them in yellow for the YMDs and I'm sure it would cover stoneflies as well. Last July one evening I got a huge thump and break on one fished down and across when I ran out of specific sedge pattens.
The deer hair thing (can't remember it's name) is a cracking fly but its now almost, but not completely, been superseded by something that is livelier on the water, floats better and can be more easily seen.
Of course it could all be self fulfilling prophecy stuff but at the moment it has magical properties and I intend to worship it accordingly :8)
Actually most half way decent flies will work like that about 80...90% of the time as long as the presentation is good. For the other 10...20 % you need others. Although this also depends on where you fish.
I reckon the cdc / elk is the most effective fly of the two, however as I have said already I avoid cdc when I can especially if I am expecting to catch a lot of fish. My biggest issue with the DHE is poor visibility, it's probably one of the most difficult dry flies to see on the water.
Quote from: Mike Connor on June 12, 2013, 06:16:45 PM
Actually most half way decent flies will work like that about 80...90% of the time as long as the presentation is good. For the other 10...20 % you need others. Although this also depends on where you fish.
That's not been my experience Mike.
Quote from: admin on June 12, 2013, 06:18:49 PM
I reckon the cdc / elk is the most effective fly of the two, however as I have said already I avoid cdc when I can especially if I am expecting to catch a lot of fish. My biggest issue with the DHE is poor visibility, it's probably one of the most difficult dry flies to see on the water.
It's aero dry wing for me now. The CDC when wrapped round a hook builds up not too bad a body though and those trailing fibers.......
Quote from: east wind on June 12, 2013, 06:25:55 PM
those trailing fibers.......
Yes, I have no doubt at all that's what does it.
mobile "legs"
You can use a shaped foam post instead of deer hair, seems to work just as well and is a lot less bother. I don't think there is any reliable substitute for CDC. Does seem to work well on some dry flies, just a pain on others, and in my opinion not worth the bother involved.
"That's not been my experience Mike."
A major problem when discussing various things is that our experiences and how we interpret them can differ massively.
Quote from: Mike Connor on June 12, 2013, 06:54:00 PM
A major problem when discussing various things is that our experiences and how we interpret them can differ massively.
Correct Mike, on most subjects in fishing we can only relate to personal experience. No point discussing things in absolutes.
Quote from: east wind on June 12, 2013, 06:25:55 PM
It's aero dry wing for me now. The CDC when wrapped round a hook builds up not too bad a body though and those trailing fibers.......
I sometimes use McFlylon - what is different about aero dry wing, is it worth getting?
Quote from: admin on June 15, 2013, 10:03:33 AM
I sometimes use McFlylon - what is different about aero dry wing, is it worth getting?
Here is a Product Description. I have not seen it anywhere or know anyone that has used it. $9/10 per card, but I have read it is a good product.
Product Overview:
Polypropylene material in a flat configuration (like braid) for wings and parachute posts. The fibers have hollow chambers that result in a specific gravity of 0.68 (much lighter than water). It is non-absorbent, easy to work with and the material can be split for micro patterns. http://www.jsflyfishing.com/cgi-bin/item/SM-700458-0000/59000/Tiemco-Aero-Dry-Wing.html (http://www.jsflyfishing.com/cgi-bin/item/SM-700458-0000/59000/Tiemco-Aero-Dry-Wing.html)
Quote from: admin on June 15, 2013, 10:03:33 AM
I sometimes use McFlylon - what is different about aero dry wing, is it worth getting?
It's much more expensive for a start Fred. I still have McFlylon but rarely use it now I just find it a bit stiff, perhaps alright for posts?. The aero dry wing
seems to be softer and can be spread about more. It's when the fly is drifting I think this softness gives it a better appearance of life than McFlylon. The closest thing to CDC without the maintenance grief, that's my thinking anyway but I don't have experience of a wide range of materials.
I use the medium or dark dun, the stuff seems to reflect daylight making it light coloured and it easy to see and in the gloaming it changes to black and stands out a mile through the murk.
Quote from: east wind on June 16, 2013, 01:01:05 PM
I use the medium or dark dun, the stuff seems to reflect daylight making it light coloured and it easy to see and in the gloaming it changes to black and stands out a mile through the murk.
I'll order some
Quote from: admin on June 16, 2013, 06:28:33 PM
I'll order some
As Darwin says it comes wrapped round a card and will last for a while. I double up or triple up the group of fibers as they come off the card to make enough for a wing. I use it for BWO's or other flies that size or smaller for the night fishing (a month late as well :)) This is where the softness of the stuff is useful.