Do we really need wings.

[Traditionalist]

As you and I and others have said, it doesn't matter how or what or where you fish as long as you enjoy it

Agreed, but there is no reason one should not look at other methods, flies, gear, etc. Something might be better!

[Traditionalist]

there is conviction in this and more than a little suggestion that the secret is in the way they are fished, i don't own a wet fly never mind a winged one, and my whole approach is as Alex describes, match the hatch river or loch, but i'm pretty sure there is more to the wet fly than the heavy duty blind fishing, or cast out and pull in thing i see people do, i'd like to see it done well and figure it out, i imagine it more like dapping than lure fishing.

There are various ways, but the most effective methods on rivers are more like dry fly fishing, matching the hatch is also a good idea and often ignored.

[Wildfisher]

and my whole approach is as Alex describes, match the hatch river or loch

That works if there is a hatch to match. The biggest mistake in fishing  is to be dogmatic - just because a DHE worked today does not mean it  will work tomorrow. Be flexible. There was a time when The Alexandra was banned on many rivers, long time ago. it was considered far too much of a fish killer. You don't get much more winged and wet. Me? I've never caught a fish on one - that's because I never use it.

If I only used a DHE then 100% of my fish would be caught on it. It would also have meant I'd have blanked up at a certain hill loch last year when The Butcher and Peter Ross were doing rather well.

[Tweed]

i don't own a wet fly never mind a winged one, and my whole approach is as Alex describes, match the hatch river or loch, but i'm pretty sure there is more to the wet fly than the heavy duty blind fishing, or cast out and pull in thing i see people do, i'd like to see it done well and figure it out, i imagine it more like dapping than lure fishing.

I don't profess to be an expert but given the right conditions, but with no obvious rise on, and particularly from a drifting boat I'll take a team of wets, fished blind or otherwise, over the dries on most occassions.  IMHO a great way of fishing on their day - and probably a cross between the dapping/lure fishing you describe.

[Malcolm]

All the really good loch fishermen I have met have wet flies as a major part of their armoury. Most of these have wings. Sometimes dries outfish wets but my experience on Scottish waters is that someone who is a good wet fly fisherman will outfish a dry fly fisherman more often than not. I know that sort of statement winds up people who sometimes do well on dries - and I personally happen to catch more on dries than wets but that's more down to my incompetence with the traditional wets than the superiority of the dry fly.

There's also a huge amount of skill involved fishing sub surface. Really good clyde style fishermen are great to watch and the they are really prolific catchers of trout. Which is not to say that stalking rising trout is not a fine skill to have. It seems to me that all these forms of fishing can be extremely skilful and it's a shame to proclaim any one greater than another. I spent many years with the dry fly and nymph on the chalk streams and naively thought of it as the apex of skill. Twenty years on I realise what a foolish thought that was. So at the grand old age of 55 I'm starting to just get a handle on wet fly fishing on rivers. Not the chuck it and cance it of myth but a rare skill in it's own right.

Even salmon and seatrout fishing with big gaudy flies and heavy sinking lines has much more skill attached to it than the unobservant person will ever see!

[Traditionalist]

I don't profess to be an expert but given the right conditions, but with no obvious rise on, and particularly from a drifting boat I'll take a team of wets, fished blind or otherwise, over the dries on most occassions.  IMHO a great way of fishing on their day - and probably a cross between the dapping/lure fishing you describe.

I agree with that, given the right choice of wets.

[Traditionalist]

That works if there is a hatch to match.

That's the main trick Fred, matching the hatch when there isn't one! Seriously, if fish are obviously feeding, and you can match the hatch then you will probably do OK.  If they aren't feeding you can still try to deduce what they might take, and this should be more effective than blind choice, but in a lot of cases they may well take anything or nothing.

[Wildfisher]

There's also a huge amount of skill involved fishing sub surface.

For sure. when I was out on Loch Lee with Eric (hopper) in August he caught at least 2 fish for every one I caught, perhaps more.  That was not "luck"

[Traditionalist]

For sure. when I was out on Loch Lee with Eric (hopper) in August he caught at least 2 fish for every one I caught, perhaps more.  That was not "luck"

That's a point that comes up time and time again, and is very interesting indeed. There is a big difference between knowing how to do something and actually doing it, and it is not primarily due to "luck" and "skill" as such. It depends mainly on talent.

For instance, I am only a mediocre guitar player, I know how to do it but I will never be very good regardless of how much I practice or learn,  because I simply don't have the talent for it ( unfortunately).

I am pretty good at quite a few things, but the only thing I have always truly excelled at is fishing, and this is because I have a talent for it, also, over the years the more I have learned the luckier and more skillful I have become.  This is basically inexplicable  to others. I can't teach it either, although I have often demonstrated it. ( Pisses a lot of people off!   )

This is more or less universally ignored, but it is nevertheless true that some people have a high degree of  talent for something and others have less or none.  No matter what you do, you will never be as good as someone who has such a talent unless you have similar talent. Doesn't mean you can't enjoy yourself, but you will not reach the same level of skill when the talent is not there. This applies just as much to fishing as it does to many other things.

[Inchlaggan]

When a spectator shouted "lucky" when Gary Player holed a long putt, Player replied "The funny thing is, the more I practice, the luckier I get."