Last night I was watching casting videos on youtube and watched Mel Krieger's loading and unloading the rod for about the 10th time! He's really got the knack of firing you up! I actually took his advice and got up, set up a rod and just started messing about with it. Within no time I'd identified loads of things I was doing wrong. For one, it's surprising how little movement it takes to load the rod and how rubbish I am at moving the rod tip in a straight line! I seem to naturally move from left to right, so I set up a straight line on the curtain in front of me and will get the straight line action into muscle memory.
Quote from: davefromtheattic on January 21, 2011, 04:43:39 PM
Last night I was watching casting videos on youtube and watched Mel Krieger's loading and unloading the rod for about the 10th time! He's really got the knack of firing you up! I actually took his advice and got up, set up a rod and just started messing about with it. Within no time I'd identified loads of things I was doing wrong. For one, it's surprising how little movement it takes to load the rod and how rubbish I am at moving the rod tip in a straight line! I seem to naturally move from left to right, so I set up a straight line on the curtain in front of me and will get the straight line action into muscle memory.
Dave, when working on tracking I find it helps me to stand in front of a mirror (face on) and work on making the arm movements while keeping my elbow pointing at the mirror.
Alex
Cheers, I'll give that a shot. SWMBO will think I'm daft, but no more than usual :)
Quote from: haresear on January 21, 2011, 05:57:28 PM
Dave, when working on tracking I find it helps me to stand in front of a mirror (face on) and work on making the arm movements while keeping my elbow pointing at the mirror.
Alex
Alex,
I followed that tip tonight ... till my arm and shoulder ached. My lawyer will be in touch ! Good compen, I believe, for maliciously induced frozen shoulder !! :lol: :lol:
J
See you Sunday [ with an estimate ] ! :lol:
QuoteAlex,
I followed that tip tonight ... till my arm and shoulder ached. My lawyer will be in touch ! Good compen, I believe, for maliciously induced frozen shoulder !! Laughing Laughing
J
Jim, you must have got this wrong. Think of the rod as a big dart, but you are holding it by the sharp bit, with the flight pointing vertically.
Anyone have any darts for Sunday?
Alex
I think I've just realised today that the fast actioned rods are going to the back of the cupboard. I'm not ready for them yet, I'm just another victim of the marketing brigade. I was out today with the Fladen 4wt overlined with a #5 (the rod that I set-up after Mel's Video) and was loving it. The window to analyse and make changes is so much larger and I could actually feel the rod working. I'm taking out my first fly rod tomorrow which is slow actioned to see what effect that has.
I'll try that position tomorrow Alan, my tracking was better today. I'm at about 1 in 4 straight. Practise, practise, practise!
Quote from: davefromtheattic on January 22, 2011, 08:53:58 PM
I think I've just realised today that the fast actioned rods are going to the back of the cupboard. I'm not ready for them yet, I'm just another victim of the marketing brigade.
Forgive me for this type of post on this forum as I am not a qualified casting instructor. However..
I asked a question on another forum about the difference in casting between an out and out casting fast action rod and a normal rod. The answer from a very fine distance caster was , wait for it - 5 feet!
I personally like very slow actioned rods by modern standards. There is one very good reason for this: slow actioned rods are much better at spey casting and it makes very little difference in practical fishing terms for long casting.
At extremes a horrible 5 weight SAGE TCR can cast over 140 feet. A nice fishing rod like the 5 weight XP can cast over 130 feet. The difference is that the 5 weight TCR will not deliver a Spey/switch/roll cast with more than 15ft lead but the XP can with more than 40 feet beyond the tip ring. I know as I've tried them both. For really flexible casting you need a medium action rod.
If you need to cast more than 90 feet with a 5 weight and can't do it, the answer is not to speed up the action of your rod it is to learn how to cast with the rod you have.
Again apologies for the lecturing tone of this post. I promise not to do it again!
I didn't find your post lecturing in the slightest, in fact it has really just listed all the things I've come to realise over the course of the winter. I've been really focusing on my casting in the last few months and absorbing as much info about it as I can. Now with an , albeit probably basic, understanding of the physics behind whats going on I can see that a fast actioned rod isn't going to perform roll casts very well in my hands. Only once I've got the stroke sorted on a medium actioned rod could I think about the fast. Even then, a medium action is probably a better fishing tool for landing fish anyway.
Thanks for posting.
Quote from: davefromtheattic on January 23, 2011, 12:44:58 AM
I didn't find your post lecturing in the slightest, in fact it has really just listed all the things I've come to realise over the course of the winter. I've been really focusing on my casting in the last few months and absorbing as much info about it as I can. Now with an , albeit probably basic, understanding of the physics behind whats going on I can see that a fast actioned rod isn't going to perform roll casts very well in my hands. Only once I've got the stroke sorted on a medium actioned rod could I think about the fast. Even then, a medium action is probably a better fishing tool for landing fish anyway.
Thanks for posting.
I'm going to be difficult here as usual! :lol:
Malcolm - the TCR like rods in the hands of some excellent casters are definitely capable of some mind blowing spey casting. I've seen some videos of some great casting with crazy stiff rods but whilst I am saying that, the XP is a lovely rod for speys....!
Incidentally, I've been saving for a while and am about to invest in a #6 TCX and boy I cannot wait! :lol:
Dave - I don't agree with the medium action thing for landing fish. My rod is one stiff rod to cast but bends double when playing a decent sized fish, to say this rod doesn't help absorb the shocks and head shakes of the fish would be nonsense. I have no problems at all playing fish on the stiff rod.
Basically in any cast what happens when the rod bends is the tip tracks a straight line path in a good cast. You are imparting acceleration to the line in the most efficient way, pulling it along a straight line. The longer you can make this straight line of acceleration, the more energy you will get into the moving line. This is where most people have trouble, they can't get enough of a bend out of the stiff rod to apply acceleration over a longer straight line distance than they can with a softer rod. Like Malcolm says though, I've also been told that, the differences in extreme distance are not
that much more. And if you can't cast a 5 weight line over 90' - learn how to track straight! It's bloody difficult but it's the biggest thing that robs distance, everyone is strong enough to power the cast but they canny move it in a straight line! Me included and it annoys the hell out of me! :lol: Paul Arden says the difference between a 100' cast and a 120' cast is tracking.
Quoteto say this rod doesn't help absorb the shocks and head shakes of the fish would be nonsense. I have no problems at all playing fish on the stiff rod.
I didn't say a stiff rod doesn't, I just think it would be kinder to your tippet.
Out of interest, what did you learn to cast on Scott?
It's not the TE mind. I might actually be interested in that you know! Had another breakthrough at today's 4 hour practise session. Elbow tight in = decent tracking and somehow more power, probably due to the v shaped loop. It's the first time I've felt the line trying to rip out of my line hand! I need to work on getting the power right now but clearly some of the ''ingredients'' of the cast are getting in the right ball park. That's using the Fladen!
Quote from: scotty9 on January 23, 2011, 03:11:31 AM
I'm going to be difficult here as usual! :lol:
Malcolm - the TCR like rods in the hands of some excellent casters are definitely capable of some mind blowing spey casting. I've seen some videos of some great casting with crazy stiff rods but whilst I am saying that, the XP is a lovely rod for speys....!
Yes they can Scotty, in fact you can spey cast huge distances with them - but only if you place the fly perfectly and that isn't possible in many situations. Do you remember when we were playing about with a long length of line out in front of the rod then trying to switch cast? With the TCR that doesn't work - the rod has unwound by the time you want it to be coming into full power. Anyway I'd have thought you would have bought a Hardy Sintrix rather than the TCX. The TCX is just so last week!
Dave - I'm not convinced about the tippet argument to be honest :lol: Just my opinion of course, yes the softer rod will give slightly higher immediate shock protection but I don't see it as an important factor.
Malcolm - good point, yes that was a great exercise. I was of course thinking of the optimal kind of as much line anywhere you want! And the Sintrix, I can't try the thing over here and it's super expensive! I'm getting the TCX at US custom build price, less all taxes and very cheap postage to me thanks to friends over there!
Alan - just so I can amaze with what I can do when I get back :8) Only kidding, I've gone downhill a good bit thanks to no practice and all fishing! I know for a fact the #6 TCX is usable with lines from a #5 floater to #9 sinkers depending on what you're doing so it's gonna be my cover everything rod - distance fannying around, #6 fishing, pike fishing etc and then i'll catch salmon on it.
Quote from: Alan on January 28, 2011, 03:15:36 PM
when you were farting about with the foreign rod designer dude at kelso, i had a shot of Andrew Parkers 6 tcx, thats the the guy we introduced to scottish hill loch fishing by making him walk 20 miles to blank :lol:
its a bit of a beast in a 6!
as per the thread...i dont find playing fish any different with different rods, soft ones absorb shock more and stiff ones you need to be more sensitive with, break off's are caused by the arm rather than the rod i would have thought.
Yeah that was quite the spectacular blank! :lol: :lol: Will need to do it again when I am back!
I got a shot of it too, managed to play with a couple out here also - it really is a beast! It's a very good rod IMO, definitely a bit nicer than the #5 weight.
Totally agree with your cause is the arm not the rod! Or sometimes the bastard fish just decides it fancies a run down the next set of rapids :lol: