The Wild Fishing Forum

I was reading the article "Montrose revisited" by Freds old pal A G-S in this months T & S.
As I have stated elsewhere on this forum, I don't know much about salmon fishing or the politics behind it, but the more I read about the netsmens, to quote A G-S "commercial exploitation" in bias articles like this, the more it leaves a bad taste in the mouth.

Surely the netsmen are trying to earn a living for themselves, and it is those who lease the rivers for sport and make money from angling who are commercially exploiting the salmon.

I would think that a lot of these netsmen have been born to this life, as probably their parents and grandparents before them were.
There must be a way for both angling and netting of salmon to exist side by side. Or is my thinking totally off the mark?

Is it just me or does anyone else feel this way?

By the way,this article is a follow up on an earlier piece that I
haven't read, so maybe thats where I am missing the point.

Billy

Well, I have no love for or connection with  any nets-man. However, I have yet to be convinced  that the tweed clad “gent” on some elitist  river beat has any more right to the fish than he  does.  One should  not expect much better though from the likes of  Graham hyphen hyphen stroke  stroke what’s his name after reading his comments about the Great Unwashed’s  beat of the Conon.  Pity too, he is a good writer.

It really make me laugh to read phrases like "commercial exploitation"  being  applied to nets men, while ignoring the ?1K +   / rod week on some rivers

But perhaps that money is going to charity?   :lol:

Aye he is and he's done some good work to promote a better understanding between fishing and kayak interests too.

here's an interesting quote;

"The fish that was yesterday miles from land was claimed by the landlord as soon as it reached the shore and so were the birds of the air as soon as they flew over his land.

The law made it so because the landowners were the lawmakers; and it was a wonder that the poor man was allowed to breathe the air of heaven and drink from the mountain stream without having the factor and the whole of the county police pursuing him as a thief"

From a Skye crofter at a Land league Meeting in 1884, 2 years after the Skye landlords had banned all crofters from such scurrilous activities as keeping a dog and collecting driftwood from the shore (as the driftwood was his lordships sole property)

Aye,  and  there are still dinosaurs in our ranks  who defend such things and  when they don’t catch fish, still rant on about murdering seals and any bird with hooked beak and claw.  Thankfully though they are a dying breed and  in  20 years or so most of them will have passed on to that great salmon beat in  the sky, or more likely, to a  "well heated"  fishing hut a good bit lower down. Let us hope that fishing manages to survive their special brand of idiocy.

I just think that the angling press paints a bad picture of a man going about his business, earning a living for himself and family.

Have the number of nets increased? Is that why there is so much animosity towards the netsmen?


Billy

I think some of the stuff that appears  in the angling press and on many forums  just reinforces  the stereotype  of  the tweedy old  sportsman who is out of touch with both the modern world and with public sympathies. Not all, just some. When  support  for fox hunters  for example, appears  in editorials and in letters pages it only harms angling and reminds me why it took me  many years of soul searching before I started going fishing again after a 20 year lay-off.  Some seem hell-bent on self destruction. You would have thought that  having witnessed fox hunters trying and failing with nonsense arguments like “vermin control”  they would think twice about applying similar arguments.  Sadly not.

Quote from: Bandy Catcher
So where is Allan Liddle anyway?  :D

He’s up in Shetland attending Up Hellevah Sair Heid or whatever it’s called.  :lol:

Quote from: SwithunI seem to remember having to duck for a while to avid the incoming fire when I had that letter published in FF&FT - saying almost exactly that Fred.

Fishing just isn't like that any more.  For eg: we have a robust debate here between salmon and non-salmon anglers.  But we understand each other - and probably only disagree about the extent to which the tweeds still exist.  Unfortunately, that is not representative of the wider bunch out there.  I just want to go fishing.  I don't want to stop anyone else doing anything - unless it is elitist or destructive.  Give me a rod...I'm away...

Cheers

Swithun

I wrote a letter to T+S about 4 years ago saying much the same Swithun and had it published. I too was attacked by the pro fox hunting crowd, or at  least by  anglers who believed  that by standing  shoulder to shoulder with these folk was a wise thing to do.   In some ways  it pleased me as it proved my point. But  the sooner the old school are out  off the picture, the safer angling will be. The difference in attitude  to fishing  between  these people and for example my son Martin, is like night and day.

Jim,  well said,

My dad’s uncle, a fellow called Jock Spink who lived at Hillside, near Montrose used to work for Johnston’s  He worked there for as  long a time as I could remember. It was his livelihood. I wonder what folk like him  get  out  of net buy-outs and better rod fishing for rich men?   The dole  I wouldn’t wonder. Don’t get me wrong, I am no netsman lover, but there are two sides to every tale and my instinct is to go with ordinary working folk rather than some  tweed bedecked twatt who wants to catch a  few more fish on his annual trip to the provinces.   :)

QuoteThe guys who own the netting rights are wealthy individuals , they wont get their hand dirty.

There will be no full time jobs involved , part time , seasonal , very low paid work only.

Thanks Jim I didn't know that. I thought the netsmen were self employed.

I agree with you Paul:

QuoteA properly managed fishery , with a sustainable spawning stock biomass , can sustain both netsman and anglers without conflict .

Thanks
Billy

Billy,

There are / were both. Some were run by rich concerns some by individual. On the Thurso for example, estuary netting and rod fishing  is controlled by the same estate.

Thanks Fred,

QuoteOn the Thurso for example, estuary netting and rod fishing is controlled by the same estate.

So will they be closing down their nets then, or is it only non estate owned nets that get bad mouthed.

Billy

I asked Eddie McArthy  (river head keeper) about this and he said that the revenue from netted fish helps keep the angling rents down.

Now that the river is to be syndicated and become a near total exclusion zone for all but the fabulously wealthy, I wonder if this will continue?

Fred,
That confuses it a bit for me ( I know I'm a bit o a dunderheid ). Does that mean that on the Thurso its not about the numbers of salmon the nets catch, but where the revenue is going?

Cheers
Billy

Billy, as far as I can see it’s just about revenue, no matter where it comes from.

A  good post Blackwitch. As I said, for the life of me I cannot understand how it is the likes of  “salar properties” and their ilk can believe they have more rights to the fish than the man with the net who is carrying  out a tradition  that goes back 100’s of years?  I have no wish to see the rivers  cleaned out by nets, but that does not mean to say there is no room for a bit of netting too, on  small scale anyway. There is no room in modern Scotland for the kind of right wing elitism and privilege that magazines like T+S seem to promote. Perhaps I read this the wrong way, but that’s certainly the impression I get when I read stuff like this from  Andrew hyphen hyphen and co.

Quote from: Jedi

One point from the article (and I'm sure this will please you Fred ) one of the arguments for keeping the nets is the netsmen police the mouth of the river and control the seal population.

Jim, I must say that really surprises me  :lol:

There is no doubt that in the 60’s and beyond, companies like Johnston’s  played a big part in decimating stocks. As kids at Lunan bay we used to let fish out of the bag nets if out night fishing, but don’t tell anyone.  These are not really the kind of netting operations I could support. That is a long way from one man and a haaf net though.

A point of interest, the latest proposals in the SE fisheries consolation document talks of the removal of barriers to fish ascending the rivers. Like Morphie dykes  I suppose. I wonder though if that will mean Sir Hyphen  and co will have to remove the artificial barriers and “holding pools”  they create on some rivers?

Do you think I should   be holding my breath on that one?  :lol: