Trout and Salmon are at it again! I know, I know, shouldn?t be reading the landed gentry?s mouth piece but the in-laws pay the subscription and it beats a dodgy jumper! Anyway, there is a reasonable article about grayling fishing on the Tweed. Techniques are very similar to those I employ on the Earn so found it interesting but right at the end of the article there is a wee rider (inset into the final picture) saying:-
?SHOW RESPECT TO FELLOW ANGLERS ? Always remember if you are fishing for trout or grayling on a river famous for its salmon that salmon-fishers will have paid dearly for their sport. Most beats are booked months or even years in advance so, even if the river is very low, salmon-fishers will want to have a go. Don?t wade through the salmon lies, always go in behind a salmon fisher and generally show courtesy to those who have probably paid a small fortune for the dubious privilege of flogging a shrunken river under a hot sun.?
In other words ? you horrible working class oiks, who don?t have the spending power to afford some real fishing, doff your caps and try stay out of my line of sight or I?ll set the Ghillie on you!
Who ever added the rider obviously never even bothered to read the article which was generally about up-stream nymphing and not the sort of thing you do by ?following behind a salmon fisher? and lets face it, the grayling are more likely to be disturbed by a heavy salmon line being spey cast down and across a pool, rather than the salmon being disturbed by someone fishing an upstream nymph on a dry fly set up.
I?m all too aware that salmon is king (I fish for them myself) and that we only get to fish some beats for trout and grayling under the strict understanding that we don?t get in the salmon fishers way but boy does it get on my goat when they disturb my fishing!
Looks like I?m going to go back to the dodgy jumpers!
Norm
Dont see why Salmon should be the King of fish......bloody stupid fish more like it, damn things dont even feed in the river :angry;
“SHOW RESPECT TO FELLOW ANGLERS – Always remember if you are fishing for trout or grayling on a river famous for its salmon that salmon-fishers will have paid dearly for their sport. Most beats are booked months or even years in advance so, even if the river is very low, salmon-fishers will want to have a go. Don’t wade through the salmon lies, always go in behind a salmon fisher and generally show courtesy to those who have probably paid a small fortune for the dubious privilege of flogging a shrunken river under a hot sun.”
If ever there was an incentive to take up canoeing.
Trout and Salmon is in a time warp. I would not wipe my arse with it. It is manifestation of everything that is wrong with angling attitudes. I have said it before and I'll say it again. The average Scottish angler would be far better placed were there no salmon in our rivers. Sad but true.
The sad thing is that the salmon is a magnificent fish deserving of admiration and respect. It’s just a pity that so many rich dickheads are attracted by fishing for it and that this leads to the exclusion or at least the attempted exclusion of ordinary anglers even if they have no interest in catching the bloody things and are after "lesser" species. All justified by the money required to perpetuate the status quo.
Agree with a lot of the last few posts. I buy Trout and Salmon for a couple of reasons. Jon Beer and (occasionally) Lawrence Catlow.
When they go I will too. A lot of the attraction went when they stopped publishing articles by Gordon Mackie (or Geoffrey Oaklands as he was sometimes known).
Quote from: Swithun on September 04, 2006, 04:02:47 PM
Malcolm,
Isn't he the bloke who does that "view from the chalk streams" column
He did write (almost exclusively) about the Wiltshire Avon and the rivers around Salisbury, he didn't have much choice as when he could afford a car it was of a standard that meant while it might go 20 miles without a breakdown but more likely not. Ok I exaggerate but not by much. His main interest and one he campaigned long and hard about was habitat destruction as a result of insecticide use and water abstraction. I wish we had a few thousand more who are as passionate as he is. I've always thought of him as the mouthpiece of the common man of the South of England. When reading about chalkstreams it's as well to remember that the
average chalkstream fisher is no wealthier than the average fisherman. Probably far poorer. A lot of really good fishing is in the hands of the clubs - Salisbury and district angling club for example. Gordon was a member of SDAC as well as a couple of others.
Quote from: Swithun on September 04, 2006, 04:02:47 PM
and gave us all that hogwash about the hunting with dogs ban rending the countryside (where is that? Didn't quite catch the post code...) in two? Or have I got the wrong one?
I don't remember the article in question - if he wrote that he had probably thought long and hard about it - remember the people in those little villages hated interference in what they saw as meddling in country life from "those posh barstards up in Lon'on". I lived in one of these villages for years and while they were very friendly people they had their own way of life that revolved around the pub, cricket, fishing, fox-hunting, ferreting, coursing and bar billiards. When I was there there were very few wealthy people there and if I remember rightly I think the local Master of the Hunt was a brickie. Quite different from the media portrayal of the foxhunter! BTW I have no interest in foxhunting but a lot of the people that the ban affected weren't millionaires or anything like it.
.....Just as most of the salmon fishermen I know are far from the image portrayed in the Trout and Salmon! Then again I fish the Leven and not the Dee.
Is that the same chap (Mackie) who now writes about chalk streams in FF+Ft each month? I must confess that is another section I never read. I had not realised he had been poached from T+S
Personally I gave T&S a bodyswerve about 10 years ago, though I've copies going back to 1973 and thought it was great then. Reason????? Couldn't find the articles amongst the ads & piccies. Its like a kids comic, all photos and very little prose.
Peter
Last copy I bought was to pass some time when I was in hospital. The other patients on the ward were wondering why I was roaring and laughing. There was no way I could explain. Unless you move in fishing circles you could never understand that while it is pretty obvious that ? of the paper is taken up with ads, the remaining 25% is not ad. free either. Paul Proctor had an article on trout fishing in Northern Ireland. Every photo featured a close up of some piece of Orvis gear.
The word
ORVIS
Taking centre stage. It hit you like a kick in the crotch.
Mr Proctor works for Orvis.
I decided then never to buy it again. Reason? T+S in my opinion, is showing a cynical disregard for the folk who buy their magazine. I don't mind ads. I am just not prepared to pay for them. With that % of ad content the magazine should be given away free.
Hats off to FF+FT – there the ads are a little more "under control"
Come on Fred, when did you lst watch a James Bond movie without noticing the blatent ads throughout?? He's only following the trend!!
Hey where did the 'more' emocions go to???
Quote from: rabbitangler on September 05, 2006, 10:19:25 PM
He's only following the trend!!
A fine line exists between following the trend and f***ing the dog :lol:
[/quote]
A fine line exists between following the trend and f***ing the dog :lol:
[/quote]
Who said that? Confucious?
Crocach,
This may well be, but whatever the motivation it does seem to mean less ads and more content (even although most of it is of no interest to me personally). For a mag. with a monthly distribution of 18,000 it certainly has far less ads than T+S with 35,000 I am surprised they cannot sell ads if this is in fact the case. I advertise Fish Wild in it and the rates are reasonable – although I would not pay any more as Fish Wild is funded out of my own pocket.
Quote from: crocach on September 06, 2006, 11:57:24 AM
I suspect its scruff like us with limited folding who are buying TF&FT while the wealthy are more likely to buy T&S. Hence more adverts chasing the cash.
Precisely. And that brings us neatly back to its editorial comment, content etc
Bloody hell!! And I was just starting to feel proud of myself 'cos I've moved on to T&S from Today's Flyfisher. :( :(
:lol:
Sure - it's just that when you are starting off (and in my case, not having any mates that fish) you buy what's readily available, perhaps not even knowing what other mags are out there. My local newsagent carries Today's Flyfisher so I started off with that, picking up T&S on occasion when I'm up in central London. I think it was only last month that I saw FF&FT for the first time. I agree it's much better - funnily enough, it had a large article on Malham Tarn and I'd already got a trip planned to fish it last month, though I still blanked!
I found T&S much more useful than T's FF (won't touch that one again) - it does carry the odd article on technique that's useful when you're starting off. And the Peter Lapsey article in last month's FF&FT, whilst nominally an "exploration" of the development of "upstream dry only" rules on chalkstreams seemed to me no more than an unquestioning defence of the status-quo. Not that I can see myself doing much chalkstream stuff, anyway.....
Quote from: Swithun on September 07, 2006, 11:19:58 AM
If you like wild fishing PC, then FF&FT is lots better... Despite the whinging here (you know who you are :shock:) it's a good mag...
Well, I certainly never said it was not a good mag. just that 75% + of it does not interest me. That's not the same thing. :)
Like these "If you have a small knob then buy a big car" magazines but subtly different :D
I read the bit in question last night and frankly I'm astonished that T&S actually published it. They claim to draw their readership from a wide spectrum of anglers; did no-one on the editorial staff even consider that it might ruffle a few feathers?. It was to my mind blatant arrogance, and whilst most salmon fishers would no doubt appreciate the actions of a thoughtful and considerate trout fisher on the beat I'm sure the majority would not see 'respect' from same as their 'right' simply because they have rented the fishing.
For me however the issue is that T&S should not have published it worded the way it is and enough is enough, I shall no longer be buying this particular angling publication.
Anyway, tightstring, Greenwell.
Quote from: greenwell on September 09, 2006, 10:29:18 PM
most salmon fishers would no doubt appreciate the actions of a thoughtful and considerate trout fisher
Indeed, and most trout anglers would also appreciate the thoughtful and considerate salmon fisher. Actually most salmon fishers I have met have been OK, but then again I have not met that many.
Yes Hamish, how I hate the attitudes in that magazine. Reactionary neo-fascism or heads stuck so far up their own arses they can't see the light of day?
Well while on this topic, I had an interesting experience recently when I went to fish down in the borders. Upon entering into a certain tackle shop and cheerily asking for trout/grayling fishing permits for my brother and I found myself met with what was at best a questioning look and at worst a "oh shit what a little squirt, this man has come to destroy the salmon fishing for all the folks paying 300 quid a day". Being a reasonable chap I tried to get a bit of banter, but it was quite clear that we were not welcome. Apparently there were to be legions of salmon fishers down on the river just wanting some peace and quiet away from dirty wee trootmesters. In the end we paid 15 quid between us and caught begger all (probably us of course). And best of all there were actually very few salmon fishers to be seen. Left a bitter taste truth be told.
My sub to FF+FT has expired and I won't be renewing it.
Why?
Because I can get better, more up to date and FREE info. from the web.
The fishing mag. days are numbered. Spend your money wisely and buy books.. Books are for life. Mags are for the budgie's cage.
Quote from: Acefisher on October 04, 2006, 11:45:58 PM
Yeah Swithun ,
I,m with Hamish on this. I can recommend John Menzies in the St. Nicholas Centre in bonnie Aberdeen . Many is the lunch hour I,ve spent reading all of the fishy mags , ( and maybe others :oops: , nah , just kiddin' ) and all for free . I have to say that most can be read in a lunch time , not a lot new :( ,
Paul.
I've only one thing to say
CHEAPSKATES
Rabbitangler
Reporting Scotland
A weel kent Newsagents
Reading the mags fur free :D :D
Lucky youz
They put them in sealed plastic bags up here soze u can't get a free read.
I can't read anyway.
Davie
To bite same as the rest of my fingers
Davie
I used to get the T+S to check out Davie McPhails flies - i go to Youtube now - he's got loadsa videos posted. I remember a few years ago, the mag asked readers how they got over the problem of taking Co2 cartrdiges for theit life preservers onto flights to Florida etc etc- i wrote in saying they should simply shove them up their arse. Sadly, i never got to see my letter in print!