This post probably mainly applies to rivers, but possibly to lochs too, to a lesser extent.
I find that when I come across a rising fish and it is taking say, olive duns (or whatever), my first accurate cast with a suitable imitation will often rise the fish, assuming a drag free drift. If the fish refuses a few times, or if it takes and I miss it, I often find that I have to change the fly in order to get another take, assuming of course that the fish has not spooked and is still rising to naturals.
I used to change patterns, a dark olive say for a hackled rough olive, but now I change the profile instead and this seems to bring me better results.
Alex
Useful info. Now all I have to do is find a rising fish on the Don! :)
Col,
I agree with you re the peacock herl on olive klinks. It is too dark to my mind.
I use the curved hook style on some of my F flies as well. It makes for a quick tie and a good emerger pattern.
This is my usual approach....
It goes something like this for a fish I reckon might be feeding on duns.
1) parachute olive
2) sparkle dun or comparadun
3) snowshoe hare emerger/klinkhamer/loop-wing emerger
4) standard dry
5) standard dry I've spit on
6) USD dun
7) F fly
8) tiny F fly
9) a light nymph or a wet spider
10) try for another fish
The exact patterns may vary and I might try a loop-wing emerger instead of the klinkhamer or the snowshoe hare, the important point being that all three flies present the fish with a sunk abdomen.
I find it helps to wait until the fish rises again a few times before casting the new offering out and there are lots of things to mess about with like fly size, leader diameter, degreasing etc., but the profile change seems to do the trick a lot, but not all of the time for me, as long as the fish is still seen to be rising regularly.
I try to have as much line on the reel as possible, so that I cannot line the fish by shooting too far. Another point is that when changing flies, I can strip (not reel) the line in, tie the fly on and I'm still casting the same length of line.
Sometimes, if a fish refuses the lot, it can be worth fishing further upstream for a while and going back to the ones which I missed or which refused and give them another try on the way back down the river. I try to take a point of reference on the far bank and look for to fish from the same spot as before.
Alex
QuoteI believe colour (not contrast) is the least important of the triggers on dries.
Steve, I'd agree with that. When tying flies, I can't be bothered to find the exact match for the legs of the fly I'm imitating. I'm not too bothered whether the hackle to hand is golden olive, ginger, or light dun. I just look for the general tone.
alex
Well done Steve.
Quotestuck on the Elk hair caddis and had a great night. I don't think I saw one sedge the whole night.
On the subject of sedges. While I can see that a CDC or elk/deer hair wing might look like a fluttering wing, I've never seen a modern imitation that is truly lifelike for the stationary sedge. Some of the old patterns have the right idea with the slim (from below) wing and the body half the length of the wing, but the likes of the G&H sedge just isn't a true imitation. It works as a wake fly for me, but I don't have much confidence in it as a drifted dry.
Last year I did well at sedge time with a simple slim fly. Just a hare's ear body and a poly wing tied on top. I added a "tail" of the same stuff as the wing, just to help flotation, dubbed some spikey stuff in a wee ball at the head and fished it dry on the river.
It worked fine and I suspect this was because it was minimalist.
Harelug and I spent a long time looking at sedges and all sorts of flies from "below" on our caravan window last year. Admittedly, we were pissed, but I still remember the surprisingly slim sillhouettes of all flies.
Having said all that, I find the elk hair sedge does the trick often, even when it "shouldn't". Sometimes they want them slim and low and sometimes it is hackled and high floating.
What do you reckon?
Alex
If you don't like the peacock herl thorax on olive klinks, what would you replace it with?
I've got a few I tied with some spikey hares ear thorax's instead of the peacock, but my river fishing experience is next to nowt! They have caught fish, but so have the peacock ones.
The fish never said what they prefer... :lol:
Steve
QuoteIf you don't like the peacock herl thorax on olive klinks, what would you replace it with?
Steve,
If using Klinks to imitate olive emergers, I don't really see the need to replace the peacock herl with anything different from the abdomen. Just the same stuff (as the abdomen) as this works for me when fishing parachutes..
I must confess at this point that I have only tied a couple of Klinks. I've just bought them until now, but I will be tying some up soon. Then again, I've been saying that for ages. :)
Alex
QuoteAnd i tend to drop to Stroft or even been known to try Drennan Double Strength. Only on spooky troots mind i tend not to use this stuff as a first choice cast material. Maxima Green 3 or 4 lb for me, but sometimes, very seldom mind, but sometimes the other stuff can make a difference. I know i know why not use the other stuff all the time? Well simple answer is it's crap as a general searching / fishing material, is no where near as robust tangles much more easily and for the most part a feckin pain in the erse. But handy to have in the pocket fur tight situations!!
I found stroft too risky Allan. Not bad for dry fly, but it doesn't like quick tension, so I've binned it. Actually, I still have about 3 or 4 spools, so if anybody wants it, they are welcome.
Double strength is ok for me, but curls up a bit. I've been using Okuma Sensitech 5lb lately with no complaints at all. It's like double strength without the curly bits. I've only broken off twice since I started using it in April. Once was my fault and the other time was today, when I foulhooked a pretty big fish which ended up down a rapid. I was forced to pull for a break or it was a case of seeing the backing disappearing before my eyes. :(
I like a low diameter line for small dries on a river, but prefer something like Maxima (or Shakespeare Aerial Pro) for big flies or for nymphs (I like fluoro for droppers because it is stiff).
The profile thing. The fish were on blue winged olives today and I had a few on the parachute, before coming across a fish which took the parachute right away and I bloody missed it. It never looked at the parachute afterwards, but rose regularly to naturals. I put on a snowshoe hare sparkle dun and it came up first cast. Another good 2lb fish. :)
I agree with the CDC comment too. I only use it when after a good fish (or when I'm desperately looking for a fish....any fish). For general fishing where you expect regular action, the CDC slimes up too easily.
Alex
Quote from: haresear on June 29, 2007, 01:05:51 PM
If using Klinks to imitate olive emergers, I don't really see the need to replace the peacock herl with anything different from the abdomen. Just the same stuff (as the abdomen) as this works for me when fishing parachutes.
Cheers Alex!
I'll tye up a few and see how I get on with them.
Like I said though, I have such little experience on rivers that it'll probably take a while before I notice any difference between the two!
Another question in regards to the klink is, to twinkle or not to twinkle?
I've been tying in two strands of pearl "twinkly" stuff, and cutting it fairly short, to represent a shuck.
To me, I think the fly looks better and it seems to catch fish OK too, but so does a klink without.
Oh the dilema! :shock:
Steve
QuoteAnother question in regards to the klink is, to twinkle or not to twinkle?
I've been tying in two strands of pearl "twinkly" stuff, and cutting it fairly short, to represent a shuck.
To me, I think the fly looks better and it seems to catch fish OK too, but so does a klink without.
I would think the shuck might interfere with the ability of the abdomen to cut through the surface tension and may lead to the fly lying on its side. No harm in trying it though, Steve. You can always snip the stuff off.
Hi lads, was thinking about Alex's insights into his fly selection. I am interested in folk's opinions on:
How many times would you attempt to cover a rising fish before changing pattern?
How long would you spend on a fish before moving on?
What about different sizes of the same pattern?
I think I spend too much time on the same rising fish but am not trying as many different patterns or changing fly as often as I could.
Cheers, Polecat
QuoteHow many times would you attempt to cover a rising fish before changing pattern?
How long would you spend on a fish before moving on?
What about different sizes of the same pattern?
I don't have a hard and fast rule, but I maybe cover a rising fish 6 times before trying something else. Sometimes if the fish is on the top constantly and sipping caenis, I'll cast the same fly again and again hoping the fish will make a mistake, but it is often the case that first decent cast with a new fly provokes a rise. That happened on Saturday on two seperate fish which refused the para olive. First cast at each with the snowshoe hare sparkle dun resulted in a take.
If there are very few fish rising and few flies about, I can spend a couple of hours on one fish before moving on. If while I've been fishing to the original fish a good hatch comes on, I will probably move on sooner in the hope of finding more rising fish. I will probably come back for another shot later.
I do try smaller versions of the same pattern. On Saturday I had been fishing a 14 para olive but noticed that the flies coming off were much smaller, being blue winged olives about a 16 or smaller, so I changed to a 16. It can also help to try a really tiny fly if all else fails. I tend to use these as a last resort as it involves stepping down the tippet strength and I'm not keen on going below 4lb unless I have to.
Alex
For me, it all depends on the size of the fish! If it appears to be decent, I'll give it the full works, basically until I put it down. If its a bit smaller and I'm catching on my current fly selection then I'll probably cover it enough times to know I've got the presentation right and if its not interested move on.
Last night I must have cast 30 times to a rising fish but I knew the current was going to make the presentation difficult so simply persevered until I thought I got it right. This actually involved moving up stream for a down stream presentation. Fish took first time when I felt it was right.
Allan- I like the last suggestion! I must fill my front wader pocket with stones before entering the river. I must have spent over an hour last night covering one of only 2 fish rising on the river, it finally took on the first time covering it after the 4th fly change, thus preventing a "wogan" (blankety blank). The other rising fish I should just have thrown a stone at right away and gone home for some supper rather than flogging the river into the night and sleeping in for work this morning!
Cheers, polecat