Are elk hair emergers the same as deer hair emergers or do they fish differently?I have seen both on different websites and wondered if they are yhe same flies with differnet names.
Have I asked a stupid question and no one wants to tell me, if so I have heard worse :lol: :lol: Or have I stumped the forum, which I doutb?
Therefore it has to be me. oops :shock: :shock: :lol:
i'll admit i've been waiting for someone to answer the question myself....experience suggests guest is right but there are many Deer hair experts on the forum who may tell us more.
Perhaps we should get hold of an elk and a deer of equal weight and float them. Then we would know once and for all.
Elk doesn't compress and flare like deer hair so elk lies flatter along the body. It's also coarser than any deer hair I know so gives the fly a different texture.
Malcolm
I use elk for the sedge type patterns and its a top fly on the rivers. Used it on the Avon and didn't move more than ten yards and had fish in the teens.
Deer hair for the emergers though.
All the best
Richy
QuoteUsed it on the Avon and didn't move more than ten yards and had fish in the teens.
That's a huge fish. :lol: Only kidding Richy.
Deer or Elk? I'm with Malcolm.
QuoteElk doesn't compress and flare like deer hair so elk lies flatter along the body. It's also coarser than any deer hair I know so gives the fly a different texture.
Elks for courses. Or deer.
Cheers boys, it has confirmed what I thought Ihave to do.
Simple- buy both type of flees to add to my box :lol: :lol: :lol:
Isn't Elk just the north American name for Red Deer?
As well as being the Scandinavian name for moose?
I've got loads of different patches of deer-hair in my fly-tying kit, to be honest I couldn't put a name to most of them, I just select the most suitable hair for the job on the basis of colour and texture.
I suspect the area of the pelt from which they come is as important as the species, tho' I couldn't say for sure.
I know I use roe deer for small flies.
Sorry if this isn't much help!
Dave
Dave,
If you hit a red deer in a ford focus, you would win. If you hit an elk........
Elk are bigger than Red Deer and a totally different species. As is Moose. (No No not the wee ones in the hoose either) :lol: Moose hair is very coarse. As is elk coarser to deer. Moose main is good for tailing material and wrapping for a body. Theres lots of air that gets trapped inside the hollow bit up the center of the hair. I have an endless supply of moose hide back home as I used to hunt them every year.
Heres a Moose
(http://img366.imageshack.us/img366/737/mooseyj7.jpg)
And an Elk
(http://img365.imageshack.us/img365/1426/elkax2.jpg)
Ive alway found the best workable hair off the insides of the legs for dries. Body hair for muddlers Smelly stuff off the legs during the rut though :shock:
Caribou/Reindeer different from Elk. Caribou is an arctic tundra animal and Elk is in mountain/ forest area like Montana The one in the photo above is still in velvet so looks similar to caribou. Have used caribou for flies though. Had some mates that went up to Quebec for the hunt. On all these animals the different types of hair from different bits tie differently. I was tying some DHS the other night and was using bleached elk. Nice for visibility.
When I was still living in Canada I was a roadkill junkie always on the spy for a bit of squashed fly tying material :lol: My garage freezer was full-o- carcasses. A tail here, a hide there :wink: I used to do quite a bit of hunting to get away from guiding /fishing when I could get time off. You got me thinking now Hmmmm what havnt I tied with. Ill get back to you
Skunk yes. Theres actually a Steelhead fly called Red Butt Skunk Also tied with Marten, Fisher, Squirrel, Chipmunk, Beaver(the wood eating kind), :wink: Muskrat, Opposum, Mink, Fox, Coyote, Badger, Vole, Prarie Dog, Dog (yes my dog had a nice light yellowy coat for Light Cahills), Weasel, Stoat(since being here) I think that covers the rodents but may have missed a few :P
Stop it Boo................."Wee Jeemie"..............eeek eeek.......... :lol: :lol: :lol:
Ah hope the mice are not readin this thread :shock: :shock: :lol: :lol:
All the best
Richy
I've often thought (cos I see a lot of 'em) that rat fur would be a good material. I've never tried curing a skin though, but at least I can get plenty.
Mouse hair would be good, and the two main species (House Mouse and Field Mouse) would give very different colours. House Mouse could be pretty good for Grey Dusters.
Hmmm... Monday....Feed Mill...15 traps...any takers??
I get some unusual scraps of fur from a sporran-making pal. Usually a huge bag with bits of arctic fox, seal, silver fox, rabbit, mink in various colours and odd bits of old victorian skins of otter, badger and even (on one occasion) leopard.
My girfriend has lovely red setter coloured hair... :wink:
BTW keep yer hauns off ma lugs!
Bump...........( sorry, I'm new here :lol:)
American Elk is, as far as I'm aware just a much larger race of the same species we call the Red Deer (already mentioned here, I know).
European Elk are more similar to what the Americans call Moose.
So, why distinguish "Elk" ( that'll be American Elk :wink:) from "all other deer" in flytying circles? :think2
Any thoughts?
Cheers,
.D.
Quote from: .D. on July 19, 2007, 10:33:38 PM
So, why distinguish "Elk" ( that'll be American Elk :wink:) from "all other deer" in flytying circles? :think2
Any thoughts?
Does it have a tendency to invade other elk's territories and attempt to impose it's overgrazing ways? :D
QuoteSo, why distinguish "Elk" ( that'll be American Elk ) from "all other deer" in flytying circles?
I never really have, just using whatever deer hair is lying around for my Elk hair caddis. I must confess though, that I never realised the two animals are basically the same beast.
QuoteDoes it have a tendency to invade other elk's territories and attempt to impose it's overgrazing ways?
:lol: :lol: Nice, Fred.
Alex
Quote from: haresear on July 19, 2007, 10:50:02 PM
QuoteSo, why distinguish "Elk" ( that'll be American Elk ) from "all other deer" in flytying circles?
I never really have, just using whatever deer hair is lying around for my Elk hair caddis. I must confess though, that I never realised the two animals are basically the same beast.
QuoteDoes it have a tendency to invade other elk's territories and attempt to impose it's overgrazing ways?
:lol: :lol: Nice, Fred.
Alex
:biglaugh;
I'm the same - they're all deer (apart from Antelope: :devil), and I just use what seems best for the job in hand!
I've always been slightly bemused though: " no, you don't use Elk for that - use deer" :?
Cheers,
.D.
Hmmm..........
No cigar for me :lol:
- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elk#DNA_research
So, apparently they're different enough if you look at their DNA. Still not that different though :wink:
Cheers,
.D.
DNA analysis - like the new victorian "splitters".
I don't really know - the "Caledonian Elk" :judge; :lol: do interbreed, and produce fertile hybrids with Sika though.
One other thing - why does Red Deer not figure more often in the catalogues of British fly tying houses?
Is it because they're so rare? :roll:
Cheers,
.D.
Quote from: Ardbeg on July 20, 2007, 08:34:57 PM
Quote from: .D. on July 20, 2007, 08:12:21 PM
DNA analysis - like the new victorian "splitters".
:lol: :lol: That'll make me a splitter then. :stir
Cheers
The Mad Scientist
Bloody splitters. You should see what the Victorians did with plants – and fish! At least 57 varieties of brown trout! :D
Quote from: Ardbeg on July 20, 2007, 09:21:50 PM
.... And people call us splitters. :lol:
Cheers
Ardbeg
See - you're drawing a split between "people", and "us" (mad scientists ).
You can't help yourselves...... :lol:
.D.